Question regarding expertise skills

I have a few expertise points I haven’t used and I am trying to decide
whether to put them into toughness for armor, or arcane resolve for
elemental defense. I wanted to know if anyone had any opinions about
which one of these two skills are most useful.

Invest points into “how to be more specific when asking for help”. That’s one really awesome skill to have in my opinion… :joy:

See, all we know about what you’re trying to do is that you want to decide on something. You haven’t told us which class you’re playing, what role you want to play, what skills you already have, or the game mode you’re in.

People don’t want to give opinions when they can give you facts. Giving details when asking for help allows others to do just that.

I agree with the @SchummelBaron
you’re not getting anywhere
is the question?
Where’s your shoe pinching?
where are you getting nowhere ? :grin::grin::grin::grin:

btw, can anyone help to confirm this? if i remember correctly, i heard somewhere before that cruelty expertise isnt working as intended.

also, does anyone know if cruelty expertise increase ur pets damage as well?

CRUELTY is working as intended, only do certain terms used in the description of properties not always match people’s expectations.

For instance, some properties say they add damage while others say they increase damage. It seems that whenever the game speaks of adding damage it actually multiplies it, whereas when it says it increases damage it only adds to it.

So does the property “Adds 10% Toxic Damage” add 10% of damage to the entire damage amount. It multiplies it with 1.1. When you have several of these properties then these themself add up before they’re being applied. Having “Adds 10% Toxic Damage” and “Adds 5% Physical Damage” will result in an extra 15% damage. The entire damage will be multiplied by 1.15. This includes the damage from critical hits and these, too, do receive a benefit from it.

On the other hand, when it says it increases it such as with “Increases Damage by 10%” then it only adds another 10% of the base damage to it, but without increasing the damage from critical hits. This also includes such properties as “+50% Damage to Demons”. These only increase the damage when attacking a Demon.

To express this as a formula:

Damage = BaseDamage * (1 + AddsDamage) * (1 + IncreasesDamage + CriticalDamage)

What also matters here are the ranges of the properties. So does “Adds x% Damage” on legendary items not get higher than 15%-17%, whereas the property “Increases Damage by x%” goes up to 22%, and in case of a specific cast can get as high as 50%. The damage from critical hits however can go as high as 1000%. Because some builds can push critical hits to such high values do the ranges of up to 22% and 50% (for increased damage) no longer have a significant influence. When critical hits add 1000% of damage does a single 50% more merely equal a “Adds 5% Damage”. Or to turn this around, a single mod with the property of “Adds 15% Damage” while dealing 1000% of critical damage is as much worth as 150% increased damage, or i.e. 3 mods with each “+50% Damage to Demons”.

Thus for crit builds is CRUELTY not so very interesting, because it only works as “Increases Damage by 14%” (at rank 4) when you spend 10 expertise points in it. At least this is the common interpretation of CRUELTY and has been since I can remember it. If it was any different, i.e. if it worked as “Adds 14% Damage” then it would only give more power to crit builds, and these are already the strongest damage dealers in the game. Therefore do I not think of it as broken.

The 10 points are then better spend in i.e. ENHANCED ACCURACY where at rank 4 it gives you 38 more points in ACC or 72% more CDB. And depending on your build might you not want to go for rank 4 in ENHANCED ACCURACY, but you may want to spread the points around over all four ENHANCED expertises to get slightly more out of it. I.e. +5 STR, +13 WIL, +13 ACC and +13 STA, which gives you an extra 44 attribute points that can lead to an extra 88% in CDB.

Does CRUELTY add damage to pets? I don’t think so. I’ve never heard of it before and it does have a separate expertise for pet damage. But it’s very hard to tell at this time as we have almost no access to expertise retrainers to explore the game mechanics to the extend as most of us wish for.

Thx for the explanation, it actually helped refreshed me memory of how hellgate london does the damage calculation before it officially went down.

True that its sad we dun get readily available retrainers in alpha so we can freely test out stuff. if we could, i am sure more detailed mechanics could be dug out and verified.

OK here are some specifics and a question.

BM SOJ build. Besides Cruelty, assuming I eventually get all the BM Set pieces, where do I put the rest of the expertise points?